ghotnit

I have been a fan of the Skyline since it came out and I am very excited that I will have the opportunity to have one here in the States. But, I have one concern that has been bothering me since I learned that the GTR was going to be available in the states and that is the cost. When Godzilla first appeared, it offered things that you could not find in any other car in its class and it dominated everything that tried to challenge it. In those days of yore, the Skyline was worth every penny but now there are other options. I hope people from Nissan checkout these forums. If the car comes in at 70-80K with the specs that everyone is guessing (450bhp, 3500lb curb weight, AWD), man, there are so many cars on the horizon that would have the same performance at a lower cost. We are getting to time when 400bhp just gets you in the door and there are many cars that could be in the club very soon. AWD gives you some bonus points but the 450 club is getting pretty full. I remember when 200bhp put you at the top of the food chain but now your parents SUV could blow the doors off an 86 Corvette. In 2-3 years is 400bhp going to be special or will we see a 50k Lexus IS 500 that will embarrass our 80k GTR. Mitsubishi is not far from really putting some power in the EVO. There are low-volume cars out there like Audi’s RS series. I know this isn’t direct competition but the RS4 was compared to the Porsche in Road & Track and did very well. There are other cars on the horizon that will be direct competition to the GTR. Toyota is bringing back the Supra with 450bhp. They say that it is to compete with the Z but with the talk about it, IMHO, it looks like it could compete with the GTR at 60k. It might not have AWD but with the advancements in traction control and handling, AWD does not have the great advantage it used to when Hans Stuck raced the Audis in Trans-Am. The Corvette, a very good car now is in the 50k range and only gives up 50bhp but has a weight advantage. If Nissan is planning on making this a one-time model and making a small number of cars just to say we did it, then fine but I would like to see the car have more of a presence than an Audi RS6. The Japanese car makers had, in the past, made super cars that gave the best bang for the buck. The NSX came out it was a Ferrari at half the price. You can go back to the original Z car and find the same thing. Lexus and Infinti were the same to Mercedes and BMWs. It was a no-brainer to choose. I hope the people at Nissan take a look at the pricing and compare it to what is coming. I also hope that they are not teasing us with a one-off car and let the other car makers replace the GTR with their offerings relegating it to footnote in history like the Vector. Nissan, bring the cost down a bit and dominate the market with the GTR and make Toyota, Porsche and Ferrari tremble. I know that people are spending 50k on used “gray market” skylines in the states but you had no other choice.

I may be wrong. Maybe there the car has enough panache to warrant the price. Maybe Nissan has some things planned that will make the GTR a no-brainer. Maybe they will make the car a present day Godzilla that will destroy the competition. But if not I may find myself in a Supra looking for GTRs to feast on.

I want to know what the other members think.

bonzelite

you are a newbie so i have taken a self-imposed policy, at least for tonight, of being a bit easy on you. tonight is your lucky night.

threads and posts such as yours are so common and trite and pseudo-intellectual, ie, "nobody will pay XXX dollars for a Nissan" -- that it is nearly becoming such that it is not any longer worth answering them. and as of late, there seems to be a daily posting or thread-making about this topic, an explosion of pessimism and often hate about the GTR.

have a nice night

spt

Welcome to the site. You'll notice by Bonzelite's response that the "price vs worth" theme has been talked about a ton on this site.

One thing I've learned throughout the years is that everyone asks the same question about every car they are interested in buying. A ton of people thought the price for the evo was too much. In fact many people thought the same for one of the cars you own, the Lotus Elise. Why would you pay 50k for a car that has a 200 hp toyota motor, when you can buy a evo/sti with more power?

The bottom line that this all comes down to is the worth to the individual. Sure there are 100's of cars out there that look good on paper, but how many of them are actually fun to drive? When the new M5 came out, everyone was so excitied about the v10 and the power output it made. When the car finally came out, a lot of people were disappointed with the way it drove. It was too heavy, power assited in everyway, and it just didn't give enought feedback to the driver. These same driver's felt that the car was overpriced at $90k+. But you have to remember, that's just a handful of opinons. Some other driver may prefer it and feel that a 90k+ price tag is worth it for the car.

Specs written on paper will not determine which car is worth buying. What will determine a price justification for a car is the driving enjoyment it gives you, which can't be answered until the car gets here.

ghotnit

Thank you for your comments and thank you for allowing for my “newbie faux pas.” I did not intend to come across as trite or pseudo-intellectual. The objective of my post was to see if I was the only person who felt that the price was a bit high. I do not want to imply that I hate the Skyline or generate any pessimism against the car. I am concerned about the legacy of the car. Will it be the successor to the Godzilla and do what the past cars did or will it get lost in the mix? Cars cost and good, fun cars cost more. I agree that specs on paper do not a fun car make. I also was disappointed when the M5 came out. I was set to get one and then drove it. ‘nough said. I guess when it comes out it’ll be seen if it stands out or if it goes the way of the 3000-GT VR-4.

As a side note, the Lotus may have only 200bhp but it weighs 2000lbs and that helps. It’s also under 60k and that gives it bang for the buck.

bonzelite

right, but who wants to buy one of the ugliest cars ever made --an overpriced rigid aluminum go-kart with a Lotus name on it? not me. the car is a failure then.

oops.. no it's not!

ghotnit

I think the performance to price ratio is what kept the Lotus alive in this market.

ghotnit

Also there are other similarities between the Lotus and the Skyline. They were both cars available in other parts of the world and developed a mystique then came to the States. They both developed their reputations in driving games that made them desirable.

bonzelite

the GT-R's reputation way, way pre-existed Gran Turismo video games. the games are but one recent venue for advertising the car(s). the similarities between the Elise and the GT-R stop at the video game exposures, then, as they are not whatsoever similar cars. for that matter, all cars featured in Gran Turismo are similar because they appear in the video game --a vast stretch of premise.

insofar as mysique, nobody is pining away to acquire an Elise, past or present, in the manner of the Skyline GT-R.

spt

That's my point exactly. You may think the lotus at under 60k is worth it but others may not. Obviously you had to have driven the car to make that conclusion. Personaly I prefer a used 911 (996 or 993) over a lotus for shear driving enjoyment (I've driven both on the street and on track). The same goes for the GTR. Will it be a successor to the Godzilla and be worth it's assumed price tag? Who knows.

ghotnit

I did not mean for this thread to start a debate about the lotus and whether or not it is a good car. My main objective was aimed at Nissan. Make this car a standout and a great value. That is why I mentioned in my original post how Infiniti and Lexus were competitors to Mercedes and BMW but they were great bargains in the process. My intended point was that if there are other cars coming to the market, adjust the price or performance to make the GTR a great bang for the buck car just as the Japanese car makers had always done in the past and not to loose that part of the heritage that made the old cars special to us all. The Z car was special not only because it was a great car but also that it was such a bargain that people who could not afford a Porsche or some other high performance car could still get that same feeling in a Z. If Nissan were to adjust the price and make the car more affordable to the masses (I’m not saying make it a 30k bargain but slightly more affordable) it could stay in the market longer i.e. my comments about the Audi RS series. I would hate to see the car disappear like the other sport GTs of the past (RX-7, Supra, 3000 GT). Nissan, compete with Ferrari and Porsche in performance but the Corvette in price.